Kerry... the man in question

[PirateDanArrr]

what does everybody think of kerry? i've definetly felt tempted to jump on the I HATE KERRY bandwagon, but after reading his policies, i've found that i agree with a fair amount of them. Mainly his Education, Energy and Environmental policies. These are the three things that are most important to me, so i can't say i hate the guy. sure he's a whore, sure even these plans aren't full of holes, but he's really not all bad. what does everybody else think?
www.johnkerry.com/index.html

[Pirate Phoebe]

I think Kerry is an asshole for opposing gay marriage.
I also think he is an asshole for his pro-patriot act views.
But I must be honest, I haven't actually done much research on his polocies. One of my good friends works for the Kerry campaigne in Providence.

[PirateDanArrr]

yeah same here... the guy i'm recording with (he wants to be known as The Anal Hippopotomus in context of this recording) is big on Kerry...

[CaptainLauraD]

Hello all,
This could be a very very long response but I'll try to cut it down so you all don't have to listen to me babble
Yes, I am not a big Kerry fan at all. Yes, it is true that I would rather see him elected than Bush stay in office and Yes, I do have a general dislike for most politicians stemming from many years of their false promises, fake smiles and loads and loads of money.
But what I think is most dangerous about Kerry is not any of his political stances (though some of them are pretty dangerous (anti-gay marriage, pro-NAFTA, pro-war, pro-Patriot Act...) but the public's reactions to him. After suddenly we saw this big inspiring growth in activism under Bush (which also lead to this wonderful group, haha), I'm afraid since people are so stuck in their anyone-but-Bush rut, they are going to welcome Kerry with open arms and ignore any of his politics which are often close to or exactly the same as Bush. For example, during the DNC, Eric and I talked to some people outside of the Fleet Center, we asked them "Do you support the war?" Most said no (good choice). Then we asked them "Do you support Kerry?" and they said Yes. We then asked them why they did if Kerry supports the war? Most couldn't answer and just got defensive or walked away. I'm not saying people should not vote for Kerry just bc of this one issue (though it's kind of an important one!) but you should at least be able to explain yourself when faced with this contradiction or these Kerry supporters should do more to push Kerry to reconsider his support of this unjust war. If a large number of his supporters anre anti-war (whcih many are) Kerry should consider that contradiction! In trying to please conservatives who might vote for Bush, Kerry has supported NAFTA, the war, and other things commonly associated with Bush's administration. Also i think the button I saw sums it up quite well "Think Bush is bad? Wait till you hear about CAPITALISM" Most of the things I dislike about Kerry are simpley things I dislike about the current political system. In a country where the vast majority of people are NOT white rich men why in the world are all presidential candidates (that have a chance or ruling) from this group!? How is taht explainable?! Kerry is worth 800 MILLION DOLLARS. Personally, in a country where poverty is such a pressing issue I don't think a leader with that comfortable a life style (I'm not saying all our presidents should be starving but isn't that a bit excessive?) can ever understand the lives of many of their country. Regardless of the fact that much of this money is from corporations who are often oppressive and stifling community workers (that's another story..) Also by being at the DNC protests I just became more and more frustrated with the two-party "democracy" (which Kerry is wallowing in). I do not want to be lead by anyone who thinks that sticking the people that they have to rule and who will elect them in a pen surrounded with razor wire and police snipers is a way to "hear the people." That is such crap. Sure I can pull a lever and give someone the power to do basically what they like with the country but if I even try to tell them what they should change my comrades and I are intimidated, penned, arrested and greeted by hundreads of riot cops. Just for holding a sign. Activisits in other states have had their records taken and their houses visited by the FBI and they have been intimidated and told not to attend the DNC by federal agents who are trying to "protect" Kerry's convention. That is not right.
I know most of these arguments are not specifically for Kerry but they apply. Hoepfully Bush will get kicked out of office but also hopefully people will not greet Kerry as a savior. Kerry is lucky, because he came along during an election which, because of all this Bush-hating, has allowed him to support some unpopular (and just ridiculous, Patriot Act anyone?) things but noone will say anything bc he's just not Bush. I wish people could open their eyes to see that Bush vs. Kerry is NOT the ultimate problem. There are OTHER choices! Start organizing within your community! Yes you can't topple the system all together right now but you can start taking the things you hate about it and either try to change them or live outside them. By creating small social movements we can find cracks is this system that, in reality, views us as statistics or crazy radicals that need to be chained in and we can use these cracks! Start living the way YOU want to live, not the way the gov't and corporations tell you you want to live. We can introduce others to the mentality that two-parties are NOT a valid choice for a country of this much power and population. Maybe out of this realization something representative of the people, not ruled by corporate weath and beautiful can eventually grow.
Okay, so i lied about not being long. Geez, this is so off topic. Sorry kids! Hope I didn't put all of you to sleep, and hope to hear all of your views.
Love
CaptainLaura
PS: I agree with DanArrr, one of the greatest things about this group is the diversity of opinions, Arrrg!

[Pirate Phoebe]

That's one way to avoid the two-party thing is by creating your own community outside that sort of thing, but wouldn't it be really hard to do that affectively without previously having a back support of family with a fair amount of money?
And the fair amount of money leads more to the issue of when it's more conservative the less wealthy are being taxed while the wealthier are flourishing.
I might be confusing myself.
Does anyone see where I'm going with this?

[TheSquashbuckler]

Where do I begin. I think we should have a meeting to discuss this because this is such a huge and diverse issue with lots of other issues playing into it. Please check out this site www.dontjustvote.com/
The idea is that whether you vote or not, it's your own choice, and while it is an important decision, it is a small peice of activism. As the group points out, you have 364 days and 23 hours left each year (and even more when there is no election that year) to be active. There are gigantic problems with this country and this world, and counting on one politician to save you is rediculous. Cut out the middle man and make the change yourself. I know, I know, easier said then done. But we really need to see that voting is not enough. There is a famous saying that if voting changed anything it would be illegal. The same goes for not voting (if it could make a change it would be illegal). Neither make significant change (especially on a national level because thats to the electoral college, people know MA will go to Kerry). I really hate the "get out the vote" and all the voter advocacy groups because the idea there is that voting is the only way to make a change. Yes, I think voting (especially locally) can make a difference. On the otherhand, there are much better ways, particularly with direct action: getting involved yourself and cutting out the middle man. I personally will not tell you to vote or not vote (except not to vote for Bush) especially since most of this group is too young and regardless, mostly lives in Massachusetts. HOWEVER, I do very much stress the similarities between Bush and Kerry (which can be sickening) and also the fact that voting is the big wimp out of activism. People must take more action than voting, they absolutely need to get involved. This is one of the core reasons I am a member of Pirates Against Bush. I can explain all of this better and in more detail in person. Also, I want to say that Bush is a fundamentally terrible person, while I just oppose some of Kerry's stances. Bush rants about God and good and evil and lots of other bullshit reasoning, while Kerry and I just have some policy differences. I can respect Kerry much more as a person with beliefs (maybe because he can actually speak so I know what he thinks). I also want to say that I think Kerry is your average corporate asshole politician who, like Laura said, is full of empty promises and fake smiles (and his wallet is surely filled too).
Politicians Go Home. -7 inch Revolution

[PirateDanArrr]

since my first post, i read this AMAZING article in The Nation, which is an excellent (and truly liberal. not moderate, not radical, good, old fashion LIBERAL) magazine. The article talked about the "Anybody But Bush" bandwagon from a completely different point of view than i had ever seen before. The author of the article, Naomi Klein, talked about how she had at first felt uncomfortable with the ABB standpoint, justl like i did. here's a snippet of the article:
"TEXTBut the zealots in Bush's White HOuse are neither insane nor stupid nor particularly shady. Rather, they openly serve the interests of the corporations that put them in office with bloody-minded effeciency. Their boldness stems not from the fact they are a new breed of zealot but that the old breed finds itself in a newly unconstrained political climateTEXT" JUST HOW I HAVE FELT BUT COULD PUT MY FINGER ON! i love it when that happens. she goes on to say that the real problem with this administration is that people are ignoring the actual issues and attacking Bush. Getting bush out of office will solve VERY LITTLE. but once kerry is in office, people will stop attacking one person, but actually looking at the issues. Unfortunetly, many people will stop paying attention once bush is out. But it's still a great article. just thought i'd share it.

[CaptainLauraD]

Ahoy!

In response to Pheobe's question, money is always an issue (which sucks...but we do live in a capitalist society) but to live outside the two party system (even just in some small respects) does not have to take alot of money or be a great undertaking. even just not buying into the "Kerry or Bush! Bush or Kerry! Change your world!" mentality is living outside the system. I have met many people who have effectivly attempted to live their life in a more eco-friendly, community organizing-friendly manner who are both well-off financially and ones who do not have much money at all. So in my mind it is possible.
Also in response to Dan Arrr's post I agree that it is terrifying that even with Kerry these politics so prevelant under Bush coudl very well continue bc a change in president does not mean a change in the way things are done. Though I don't know as much as I should about Clinton I think he's a good example. He was a charismatic Democrat so when people (mostly the conservatives) attacked him at all they attacked his sex life, the country ignored the fact that he was bombing the shit out of these poor countries. Once Kerry gets into office will all the anti-Patriot Act, anti-war people etc be silenced because they agree more with a Democrats war than witha Republicans war. Is there any differance? (In my humble opinion, no. zip. nada.)

[Ben]

I also have to agree with some of the things Kerry says in his speeches and on his website. (i.e. better foriegn relations, increased environmental standards, restored civil liberties, better public education...) but I simply cannot see him making them happen, and many of his actual plans fall short of what he says he wants to do.

For example, he says he wants to restore our freedom and privacy that was taken away by the patriot act. Which of course he voted for in the first place. And, as it turns out, he has only comited to elimenating a few small sections of the patriot act (such as giving law enforment unconditional access to library records, which hasn't really been enforced anyway) , while leaving most of it intact. He also claims to be against shipping American jobs overseas, but wait- he still supports NAFTA, FTAA and other "free" trade agreements that do just that. (Sounds just a bit like doublespeak, doesn't it....)

And as for his plans to increase the number of troops in Iraq, has he forgotten what he said when he spoke in front of congress to ask for the end of the Vietnam war? (Something along the lines of "How can you ask a man to be the last man to die for a false cause??")

Also, of course, he is also disgustingly corporate. Becuase in our psuedo-democracy, thats the only way to get the money it takes to get anywhere near being president. (But thats more an issue with the whole 2 party system and the state of democracy in this country that with Kerry...)

I also agree that its cool to have a group thats based just around, er, obvoisly being against Bush, and from there, other opinions vary and get discussed.

[yajnavalkya]

I have observed quite a lot about kerry, and I have come to a undeniable conclusion.

THE MAN IS TRYING TO LOSE

What else could explain some of the things that he does?

When he talks to the hispanic community, what does he choose to talk about?

How illegal immegrants shouldn't get driver's licenses!

Of all of the issues that he has an opinion on, he chooses to disagree with the hispanic position on one of the most important issues to them, TO THEIR FACE!

When he talks to black community leaders, what does he talk about?

Not inner city schools,
Not affermative action,
Not tax burdens,
Not racism,
But chemical weapons!

He had the chance to talk to them about something that matters to them, and he chose something that, while it's important, means nothing more to a black man then a white man. You don't give a speech to black community leaders and talk to them about something that interests them no more then anyone else.

Then bush, in his arrogance, challenged kerry with the question "knowing what we know now would you have gone to war in Iraq?"

And what does kerry say?

YES!

what the !@#$l? The main reason I liked him was because I thought he wouldn't do something as stupid as go to war with another country for no real reason.

The fact is kerry is boring and he truly has no idea how to deal with anything.

Now I know that I am not the smartest man in the world, but how is it that I can outsmart kerry's campaign?

If I could speak with kerry I would say that there are somethings that must be done.

1. FIRE YOUR CAMPAIGN PERSONNEL! they are doing nothing right! There is no reason why you shouldn't be crushing bush!
2. LET EDWARDS DO THE TALKING! what do you have over Edwards besides experiance and a war record? NOTHING! he is a better candidate by far, because he is young and doesn't look like the people on C-span.

while we are on the topic of war records. Why is it that bush AT MOST served in the air national guard OVER TEXAS (seriously, nobody is going to attack texas from the air) for TWO DAYS and Kerry: 3 purple hearts, 2 stars (bronze and silver) and a partridge in a pair tree, Yet kerry can't rise above the accusations that he didn't desirve SOME of them.

4. TALK ABOUT THE OPINIONS THAT MATTER TO PEOPLE, AND FOR THE LOVE OF GOD AGREE WITH THEM! your a politician, prostituting your beliefs should come naturally.
5. AND ALSO, take some viagra. Do something to get yourself more excited. seriously............ anything.

the main problem is kerry doesn't have to work, 45% is going to vote for him simply because his genetic make up is .01% different then Bush's. It is almost as if kerry is relying on Bush's failure to win.

As for kerry himself, He is probably too conservative for me, but what can I say. I'm as radical a liberal as there ever was.

[CaptainLauraD]

Though I am never one to bash liberals, in the spirit of discussing Kerry, a small soundtrack for your political musings.

- Phil Och's "Love Me, I'm A Liberal" (dated but oh-so-clever)
- Evan Greer's "John Kerry Blues" (he helped organize against the DNC with us, you can download it at his website http://www.evangreer.com)

Two folk-y gems for your next political sing-along.

Capt'nLaura

[PirateDaemon]

Personally, i despise kerry. I am against some of his issues, and i think that he is really a politican at heart, as opposed to a human being.

Bush described kerry as being "too liberal to be president". If you look at john kerry's issues, he's actually one of the most conservative democrats. I, myself, am a far leftist. But while i'm far leftist, i appreciate all politicians who are intelligent. John McCain, a republican, is probably one of the better politicians out there who hasn't completely sold his humanity. While i'd disagree with him on many issues, i think that i'd prefer him as a president over kerry.

That's all i have to say for the moment.

[NinjaBen]

Here's what I say. If you live in a swing state, vote for Kerry. If you live anywhere else, vote for who ever.

I'm not on the anybody but Bush bandwagon, of course there are people who could of been worse than him, but I think that Kerry will do a better job than him, thus between the two he deserves the vote.

His policies arn't that argeable (although on the war in Iraq, what else do you want him to do? Pull out and leave chaos? He can probably do a better job of finishing in cleanly than Bush) but he's emphasing some of the more conservative ones in order to reduce the claims that he's some kind of liberal nut. If you dislike someone because you don't agree with them on a few things, then you're not going to get along with many people. No one is ever going to find a politician whom with they agree with on every level.

Kerry's Flip-Flopidness is also pretty exagerated. To end a war, you have to end it somehow. Like I said, pulling out just isn't an option. Kerry's plan on getting other nations more involved is where most of his troops are coming from.

He's not really corperate either. He stole Dean's grassroots fundraising idea, and that's where he's gotten a big portion of his campaign funds. He's done a lot of speaking out against Bush's dependency and relationship with corperations.

[Pirate Phoebe]

Welllll:

(I found this on Catie Jones' live journal)